Securifi Community Forum

Sensors and Home Automation => Home automation => Topic started by: Mishakim on November 12, 2014, 03:37:24 pm

Title: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: Mishakim on November 12, 2014, 03:37:24 pm
I have several rooms in my house with no light switches, just pull-chains from the ceiling-mounted fixtures. I want to put switches near the doors, so we don't have to fumble for the chain in a dark room. It's easy enough to put wirelessly-controlled light bulbs in the fixtures, the the problem remains of putting a switch on the wall, so we don't have to use apps to turn the lights on/off. I figure it should be easy to put a Z-wave or Zigbee on/off switch where I want it, and use the (forthcoming) automation features of the Almond to make that switch turn the lights on/off. But I can't find such a switch, all the switches I see assume they're going in place of a wired switch, and require the wiring for power (and directly control the load, rather than just reporting the button press to the controller for handling).
 Can any one point me to a simple, battery-powered wireless switch, that is reasonably priced? I thought I saw such a thing recently, just a single-button Z-wave or Zigbee controller, but I can't find it now.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: fillibar on November 12, 2014, 10:05:15 pm
You could use a keyfob to trigger it (once the automation is in place) or are you looking for one that looks like a more regular switch?
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: Mishakim on November 13, 2014, 11:39:48 am
yeah - looking for something that looks more like a regular switch. Mainly, this is so my toddler can turn the lights on herself, as she can't reach the pull-chain. Secondary benefit for the adults in the house to not have to cross the room in the dark.

The Lutron Pico remote would be perfect, but it's proprietary 434MHz, and I don't have a place to put the corresponding wall switch.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: fillibar on November 13, 2014, 03:43:52 pm
I guess the other question is what do you mean by reasonably priced? I am continuously surprised by the high prices until I remind myself that this is all still "edge", although no longer "bleeding edge".

Here is one example I found:
GE 45631 @ $44 @ Amazon

I also found a few remotes... That look like old TV remotes that also do Z-Wave, if the look is second to price or it needs more than a key fob can do. Those are less than $30.
Are these kind of the direction you were looking, as far as looks and features (not price)?
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: underscore on November 13, 2014, 04:02:23 pm
Can any one point me to a simple, battery-powered wireless switch, that is reasonably priced? I thought I saw such a thing recently, just a single-button Z-wave or Zigbee controller, but I can't find it now.

http://goo.gl/JbqFhG - Aspire RF RF9500 - Battery Operated Z-Wave Dimmer Switch (doesn't have to be a dimmer)
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: Automate on November 14, 2014, 08:46:54 am
http://goo.gl/JbqFhG - Aspire RF RF9500 - Battery Operated Z-Wave Dimmer Switch (doesn't have to be a dimmer)
Man, $100 list price, that's ridiculous.  At least it's available for half that here http://www.westwayelectricsupply.com/rf9500aw-battery-operated-switch-dimmer-w-wallplate.html?gclid=CLySwZ6d-sECFeJj7Aodr38ARg
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: Mishakim on November 14, 2014, 09:15:51 am
I guess the other question is what do you mean by reasonably priced? I am continuously surprised by the high prices until I remind myself that this is all still "edge", although no longer "bleeding edge".

Man, $100 list price, that's ridiculous.  At least it's available for half that here http://www.westwayelectricsupply.com/rf9500aw-battery-operated-switch-dimmer-w-wallplate.html?gclid=CLySwZ6d-sECFeJj7Aodr38ARg

I'm in the same space, I understand that this is new tech, but am still finding the prices too high to stomach. For example, if GE can do a ZigBee lightbulb for $15 (http://www.homedepot.com/p/GE-Link-60W-Equivalent-Soft-White-2700K-A19-Connected-Home-LED-Light-Bulb-PSB19-SW27/205404345?N=5yc1vZc7chZ1z0um34), why do switches start at $50 and go significantly higher? The remote-control style controllers would fit my need as far as function, but I'm also aiming for simplicity, i.e., I only want this to do one thing, so I only want one (or two) buttons.

Really, what I want is this: Pico on/off switch (http://www.amazon.com/Lutron-PJ2-2B-GWH-L01-Remote-Control-White/dp/B00KLAXOE8/ref=pd_sim_hi_4?ie=UTF8&refRID=1KNQEMJ2B3NTTFQP066K) but with ZigBee or Z-wave. Amazon has that for $17, and the dimmer version for $15, so even at double the price for a Z* radio, you're still only at $30 - 35.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: fillibar on November 14, 2014, 12:40:27 pm
I know. A lot of it does not make sense to me, with regards to the pricing. I will try to keep an eye out. If you find something in the long run, post it in the Where can I buy... section. I doubt you are the only one looking.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: LGNilsson on November 19, 2014, 12:24:22 am
We just got this to test - http://manuals.zwaveeurope.com/make.php?lang=en&type=&sku=ZME_WALLC-S
Can't seem to find a US version and the EU version is 34 without the front panel/buttons...
Oh and it's not supported, yet...
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: mparadis on November 19, 2014, 12:52:15 pm
Fillibar - do you know if that z wave scene controller works with the almond? I know scenes aren't up yet but I'm wondering if it connects and is recognized etc. Thanks!
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: fillibar on November 19, 2014, 03:49:02 pm
I do not know personally, but I would say no. I did a quick search and it was referenced in a thread previously... It turns out (per Lars) that Secondary controllers are not yet supported (as of R69) and this works as a Secondary controller, not just a button. I would assume this means it will work someday... but other things will happen first.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: LGNilsson on November 19, 2014, 09:41:22 pm
We'll be adding support for these. The "raw" code is done, but as scenes aren't done yet on a UI level, it doesn't make much sense adding support for the devices, as they wouldn't do anything. We have started work in the scenes UI though, but rules/timers will be the first thing that'll be done. Well, technically notifications will be first, but I'm not sure if most of you will call that automation  ;)
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: mparadis on November 20, 2014, 01:31:15 pm
Thanks fillibar and Lars!
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: danski on April 04, 2015, 07:18:43 pm
Is there any update for switches like this, I am very interested in doing the same thing. so far I've been unable to find anything cheap.

Thank you.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: LGNilsson on April 06, 2015, 11:59:33 pm
Not yet, as we've been working on finishing the rules. Once that's done, the next thing should be scenes.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dewhite04 on December 02, 2015, 10:24:58 pm
I know I'm dragging up an old thread but it's pretty on-target with what I'm working on.  I also figured that anybody searching for keywords in this thread would appreciate knowing more about this:

I bought the Lutron "Connected Bulb Remote" today at Home Depot (http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lutron-Connected-Bulb-Remote-LZL-4B-WH-L01/206196450 (http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lutron-Connected-Bulb-Remote-LZL-4B-WH-L01/206196450)), which appears to be a version of the Pico style remote, but with Zigbee support included in the device.  It has the same form factor as the other Picos, which would make this remote very convenient for installing into standard decora-style switch cover locations (with the available adapter, etc).

It was easily able to pair the remote with the A+, however my hub (which is on r80 currently) reports that the connected device has as status of "Unsupported Device!"

I'm hopeful that this device is on the radar of Securifi's development team, as it has a super handy form-factor and is of reasonable cost/availability (~$30 at time of this post).

Thanks for all of your hard work - I'll hang-up and listen!
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: Ashok on December 03, 2015, 10:51:05 am
@ dewhite04,

It seems like we might not have added the support for it, please do send the log files by making sure the Almond+ is not rebooted. So that I could check with our team back and get back to with an update on this.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: TheLostSwede on December 03, 2015, 07:01:14 pm
You might want to look at the new Philips ZigBee remote, but I don't think that works directly with the Almond+, but it can talk directly to up to 10 ZigBee LL bulbs.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: bebopblues on December 14, 2015, 03:29:52 am
It was easily able to pair the remote with the A+, however my hub (which is on r80 currently) reports that the connected device has as status of "Unsupported Device!"
How were you able to pair it to the A+? What button(s) did you use to make it pair-able?

Any progress on getting this remote to work correctly with the A+?
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dancook on March 14, 2016, 07:32:14 pm
I have an issue similar to the original poster. In my master bedroom we have a switch at the door and a switch at the other side of the room which appear to do nothing. No outlets are enabled by toggling the switches and it's annoying to have these for no apparent reason. Meanwhile we have two bedside lamps which have to be turned on manually.

What I want is to replace these traditional light switches with Z-Wave switches. I have not confirmed that the wiring is 'hot', but let's assume that it is (in other words there are positive and neutral wires, not a ground though because the house is circa 1928).

Can I install something like the Leviton DZS15-1LZ, and along with two Peanut plugs and my Almond+ cause these lamps to toggle on/off? I have tested the Peanuts + Almond solution using a GE binary on/off plug-in switch, but I don't like that as a permanent solution because (a) the outlets are down at the floor level not near the doorway, and (b) I want to use a wall switch not a plug-in switch.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: Ashok on March 14, 2016, 09:46:15 pm
@ dancook,

Yes, you can use any any one of the Wall-In switch, listed under the following Wiki list.

https://wiki.securifi.com/index.php/List_of_compatible_sensors_-_Almond%2B_2014
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dancook on March 14, 2016, 11:59:14 pm
Thanks for verifying. And in this case the domestic 60Hz/110V AC power which the switch is wired into has no purpose other than to provide the Z-Wave device with its send/receive punch? Would I install two identical such switches (the room has two switches currently) and either switch would toggle the lamps from their current state to the opposite state?
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dancook on March 15, 2016, 12:20:19 am
To be clear, in this scenario there is no manual / traditional switch functionality where the load's circuit is completed or not.

I don't know what (if anything) the switches are hardwired to, thus I only care about the device's ability to send Z-wave commands to my Almond+, after which the A+ will send 'Toggle State' commands to the relevant Peanut plugs.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: Ashok on March 17, 2016, 09:02:54 am
@ dancook,

First thing, you have to ensure that the wiring at that location where you would like to place the switches should be working fine. It seems like, we have no switch at present available with out the ground wiring. May be the best solution would be use to Zigbee Sercomm binary switch.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dancook on March 17, 2016, 03:33:02 pm
I already am able to control the lamps with a GE binary on/off plug-in switch (model #45603), so a Zigbee Sercom binary switch doesn't seem to provide any additional benefit (I assume you mean this one: http://www.sercomm.com/contpage.aspx?langid=1&type=prod3&L1id=2&L2id=3&L3id=8&Prodid=102 (http://www.sercomm.com/contpage.aspx?langid=1&type=prod3&L1id=2&L2id=3&L3id=8&Prodid=102)).

So I guess the question: is there a Z-wave binary switch which can work using only line (hot) and neutral? I need just enough power to send and receive Z-commands and would gladly use a battery-powered Decora-style switch if one existed!
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dancook on March 17, 2016, 03:44:52 pm
Wait, maybe that ASPIRE RF battery-operated switch will work. I understood it to be a dimmer whereas I want binary only, but it looks like it can function as either (or both).
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dancook on March 17, 2016, 04:01:23 pm
Assuming it meets the need, does anybody know whether the Aspire / Cooper Wiring Devices RF9500 can be paired properly with the Almond+?
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dancook on April 05, 2016, 05:49:59 pm
I decided to take a gamble on the Aspire / Cooper Wiring Devices RF9500 sensor. The switch is recognized by the Almond+. Once added / learned-in, I can see the switch's value change from 0 to 255 and back again when I toggle the switch. However I can't integrate the sensor into any Rules because the Almond+ classifies the sensor as 'Unsupported'. This is unfortunate since it would be trivial to create a rule based on whether the detected value is 0 or 255.

It appears I will need to wait for the A+ firmware to get updated so that this particular Z-wave sensor is officially supported.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: fillibar on April 06, 2016, 08:32:42 am
@dancook
Thanks for sharing the information. Hopefully Securifi can support it, or at least a generalized object that allows it to work. Have you contacted Ashok or someone else directly? They watch the forum closely, but better to let them know.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: grouter on April 08, 2016, 06:29:01 am
In my master bedroom we have a switch at the door and a switch at the other side of the room which appear to do nothing. No outlets are enabled by toggling the switches and it's annoying to have these for no apparent reason.

Have you checked both the top and bottom plugs in each outlet? We have a room with a switch that controls a single top plug, but not the bottom one in the same outlet. It was somewhat tough to figure that one out...
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: fillibar on April 08, 2016, 09:55:30 am
@grouter:
Ha! They did that at every outlet controlled switch in our house... They also had the power run to the outlet (or light in those cases) then run to the switch... That has caused no end of problems when I am trying to correct or change out things.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dancook on April 11, 2016, 01:13:24 pm
@grouter, the house is pretty old and so the outlets in the bedroom are single-receptacle, ungrounded. Testing what the mystery switches do is as simple as plugging an illuminated lamp (i.e. one where the bulb is switched on) into each outlet and seeing whether the switch causes it to toggle.

Even though I have antiquated wiring I do have Peanut plugs in the living room doing their job well (in tandem with an Almond+), but in that case the lamps turn on/off on a timer, whereas I want "on-demand" in the bedroom. That's why I'm looking for a wall switch that works with my A+.

Note: In case you were wondering how I'm using Peanut plugs in an ungrounded system, the relevant living room outlets have been upgraded to GFCI-type outlets, clearly marked as "NO EQUIPMENT GROUND", which is an exception allowed by National Electrical Code to replace two wire ungrounded outlets.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: fillibar on April 11, 2016, 01:54:59 pm
@dancook:
That would likely drive me crazy... Without the grounds I mean. I would probably be going to the expense (and time) of reworking them all. Heck, I am planning some work now just to make our current circuits make a bit more sense and eliminate aluminum wiring I have found.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: DawnBede on April 12, 2016, 08:44:31 am
I understand that this is new tech, but am still finding the prices too high to stomach. For example, if GE can do a ZigBee lightbulb for $15, why do switches start at $50 and go significantly higher? The remote-control style controllers would fit my need as far as function, but I'm also aiming for simplicity, i.e., I only want this to do one thing, so I only want one (or two) buttons.

pcb assembly prototype (http://www.7pcb.co.uk/prototype-PCB-assembly/)
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: fillibar on April 12, 2016, 12:36:06 pm
It is a bit crazy, especially if you look between different devices. One major problem is the limited audience. Light bulbs are a lot easy for your average homeowner to deal than changing out switches and such. There are also very different regulations (in the US at least).

If you are looking for a simple, one button effect, you might be able to get by using a network device as a presence sensor. Obviously there are problems with it being a presence sensor but depending on your usage that method might work. Something as cheap/simple as using an Amazon Dash Button (without associating it with a product to purchase).
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dancook on April 12, 2016, 12:54:04 pm
@dancook:
That would likely drive me crazy... Without the grounds I mean. I would probably be going to the expense (and time) of reworking them all. Heck, I am planning some work now just to make our current circuits make a bit more sense and eliminate aluminum wiring I have found.

@fillibar The house is 3 finished floors including basement (no openings to main floor), lath & plaster, odd horizontal framing blocking chases down from the attic, hardwood floors, crown-molded ceilings, brick exterior. They don't make 'em like they used to, for better and for worse!

As you can imagine the time & expense of reworking the ungrounded wiring is prohibitively high. Well, at least for me it is. Maybe a future owner will be willing to pay the tens of thousands of dollars required to cut out sections of floor/wall/ceiling all over the house and chase wires around.

Hopefully this adequately illustrates my desire to find a wireless Z-wave wall switch which requires only battery power and doesn't need to switch any loads. Well, actually I did find one but it doesn't pair with the A+ yet.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: fillibar on April 12, 2016, 03:04:56 pm
@dancook: Sounds awesome... and a nightmare. I love the old, solid houses (and touring the mansions of yesterday) but I always think about how I would want modern stuff blended/hidden in. Totally understand the cost aspect. Good luck.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: dancook on April 14, 2016, 12:58:08 pm
Interestingly, pretty much the exact switch I have in mind exists but it's made by Insteon which is unfortunately a closed ecosystem (as far as I understand):

http://www.insteon.com/wireless-switch (http://www.insteon.com/wireless-switch)

"This small decorator-style wireless remote allows you to instantly create a switch anywhere in your home without running wires. Simply link it to an Insteon compatible lamp controller or wall switch."
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: canman007 on February 04, 2017, 06:32:06 pm
I tried the Lutron LZL-4B-WH-L01 and while it connects to my Almond 2015, it is unsupported and doesn't have any functionality.
I can probably provide logs, etc. if it will help.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: joltdude on February 15, 2017, 05:21:34 pm
I have a switch but I dont think its fully supported.. Its rechargable via USB.... Aeon Labs Minimote for Zwave.... was on sale on Newegg for awhile...
Albeit it requires Zwave device support.. and i dont think the Almond 3 supports it yet... (yes it pairs with the Zwave fob but thats it)

Cute remote...
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: soawesomejohn on February 16, 2017, 07:10:09 pm
I'm just getting into this myself, but in a similar position. We have a bedroom where the light switch is at the far end of the room. You have to walk through the entire room to get to it. Our local hardware store sells a proprietary wireless switch - one wired, and one you mount remotely, powered by 9v battery. But these have worn out on us.

The Aeon Labs DSA03202 v1 - Z-Wave Minimote seesm like it would be pretty good. They run around $20 on amazon and can be mounted with velcro.  These have 4 buttons, but you only need to program the one.  http://a.co/7hekclL
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: Kazy on February 21, 2017, 08:20:00 pm
Those remotes can't be paired with the Almond+ :(

I use a Philips Hue (Gen 1) that I got for $10, plus their $35 switch kit.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: joltdude on February 22, 2017, 10:48:56 am
The problem is hue switches are propriatary.... Id be thinking of asking support on here what they recommend....
There has to be some updates and voodoo for the Click switch to be supported, there may be other devices at that time Im thinking

Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: mparadis on February 23, 2017, 08:29:58 am
I'm just getting into this myself, but in a similar position. We have a bedroom where the light switch is at the far end of the room. You have to walk through the entire room to get to it. Our local hardware store sells a proprietary wireless switch - one wired, and one you mount remotely, powered by 9v battery. But these have worn out on us.

The Aeon Labs DSA03202 v1 - Z-Wave Minimote seesm like it would be pretty good. They run around $20 on amazon and can be mounted with velcro.  These have 4 buttons, but you only need to program the one.  http://a.co/7hekclL

Securifi Click should work for this function. It is coming out soon, apparently, and just working through some logistical (shipping) issues to get them here (US). It has three actions, single press, double press and press and hold. Which you could set up to do 6 different things with rules i.e. If light on and I push once, then turn light off; if light off and I push once turn light on. Same for double and press and hold. It seems to be a decent size for putting up as a "switch" creating a virtual 3 way switch essentially. I plan to use velcro to attach some of mine to spots but they can still be moved around as needed. I imagine double sided 3M tape would work well too. I may try to cut out a space in a blank wall plate to make them more switch like in appearance as well.
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: joltdude on February 26, 2017, 07:48:14 pm
Securifi Click should work for this function. It is coming out soon, apparently, and just working through some logistical (shipping) issues to get them here (US). It has three actions, single press, double press and press and hold. Which you could set up to do 6 different things with rules i.e. If light on and I push once, then turn light off; if light off and I push once turn light on. Same for double and press and hold. It seems to be a decent size for putting up as a "switch" creating a virtual 3 way switch essentially. I plan to use velcro to attach some of mine to spots but they can still be moved around as needed. I imagine double sided 3M tape would work well too. I may try to cut out a space in a blank wall plate to make them more switch like in appearance as well.
Using just double sided tape or the 3m Dual Lock (velcro-esque) =)
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: mparadis on February 28, 2017, 02:27:52 pm
Using just double sided tape or the 3m Dual Lock (velcro-esque) =)


:-D
Title: Re: Simple battery-powered on/off switch?
Post by: sfinney on November 14, 2017, 09:35:11 pm
I know I'm dragging up an old thread but it's pretty on-target with what I'm working on.  I also figured that anybody searching for keywords in this thread would appreciate knowing more about this:

I bought the Lutron "Connected Bulb Remote" today at Home Depot (http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lutron-Connected-Bulb-Remote-LZL-4B-WH-L01/206196450 (http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lutron-Connected-Bulb-Remote-LZL-4B-WH-L01/206196450)), which appears to be a version of the Pico style remote, but with Zigbee support included in the device.  It has the same form factor as the other Picos, which would make this remote very convenient for installing into standard decora-style switch cover locations (with the available adapter, etc).


I'm dragging this up again. Have a few of these I used directly paired to Hue bulbs. I paired one of them to the Almond+ on R090 today and it still shows as an Unsupported Device which is a bummer. If Securifi still needs logs I'd be happy to provide them!